Nice guys finish last…or do they?
I was having a conversation with someone last night when this topic came up - well, not directly, but by way of a comment about how this person was “sick of seeing bastards get laid”, while integrity and honesty sometimes left nice guys such as himself out in the cold.
Is the statement necessarily true? When I look at my romantic past (and, whether it be fortunate or unfortunate, there’s quite a bit to look back at), I can definitely see some instances where I’ve left the stereotypical ‘nice guy’ in the lurch. You know, the fine, upstanding moral citizen who treats women like delicate objects and thinks that pretending to be your best friend is going to get him into your pants…snoooore.
I’m not saying that you have to be a bastard to get laid - I’m friends with a few guys who definitely fall into the “nice guy” category who most definitely get their bedroom happies, but personally I think that there is something in the alpha male calm and strength (and ‘don’t give a fuck’ attitude) which is immensely desirable.
I’m sure I’m not the only one, look at the history of Hollywood stars who’ve scored legions of fans on the basis of personas or characters they’ve played or embraced - James Dean, Marlon Brando, George Clooney, James Spader, Brad Pitt, Colin Farrell, the list goes on and on. Heck, that’s part of my reason for my lust for Hugh Laurie (House), James Spader (Boston Legal) and John C. McGinley (Scrubs). Admittedly, they’re all well-written characters who have the bastard element down pat, but it goes beyond that to the self-assuredness (not to be mistaken for arrogance, though sometimes that’s a fine line), inner strength, and a degree of masculinity that makes the sexually submissive female in me weak at the knees.
Of course, this is only my perspective, as a heterosexual female with definite submissive tendencies (though only in the bedroom), it doesn’t apply to women across the board - there are, for example, women who enjoy ‘sissifying‘ their men (something that strikes me as a bit disturbing, to be completely honest) and the legion of dominatrixes who enjoy making males submit to them.
One question that comes to mind when I think about this topic is - does being a nice guy mean you’re not an alpha male? Being a female, I can only comment from an outsider/observers perspective, but personally I don’t think that it does…I think that during the means of courtship/seduction, there are definitely some bastards who do better at portraying alpha male tendencies than nice guys, but neither are mutually exclusive - both bastards and ‘nice guys’ can be alpha males. Perhaps the comment comes from the fact that nice guys who don’t display these traits are more open to making this complaint than others, which (as I write this) strikes me as having some granule of truth, as I’ve never heard a female actually utter the statement in her own right, but it’s something I’ve heard from quite a few men over the course of conversation.
When it boils down to it, I don’t think it’s about ‘nice guys’ and bastards, but about the traits generally understood to be associated with masculinity and femininity. Whatever feminists argue about society-imposed gender roles, to me, when it comes down the very basics of sexuality and attraction (and I am talking about base attraction, not the whole mechanics of a relationship), there is something in the yielding feminine nature which is attracted to the emotionally strong, self-assured, ‘don’t give a fuck’, take charge personality traits of the alpha male.
What do you think? Do you agree? Disagree? Or despite my ramblings, are you still convinced that “nice guys finish last”?
An Edit:
For the sake of clarification and so I don’t have to have the same idiotic conversation over and over with the various non-alpha males who have told me that “Nice guys get left behind”, let me add the following:
There is, in my opinion, an inherent problem with the above argument in that it’s not acknowledged that we’re dealing with two ideas - what actually constitutes a nice guy, and what the stereotype of a nice guy is.
To me, the stereotype that we’re dealing with is, essentially, a doormat that wants to get laid. The guy who is most definitely aware that he is not an alpha male and does not have any of the traits associated with, the confidence as a particular one. He is, however, aware that this is something that women find attractive, and thus in trying to get closer to them, becomes the best-friend/doormat, continuously stroking egos, being the male friend who they can talk to and walk all over, meanwhile, most probably becoming extremely sexually frustrated and having mad wanking sessions whilst imagining fucking them silly.
So, in my mind, that’s the stereotype.
The real nice guy? The one who is quietly confident in himself, is open, honest and understanding when it is required, but is also not afraid to be himself and up front, doesn’t play games and does not allow himself to be trodden all over by the object of his desires/affections/wanking, whatever the hell you want to call it.
As for what constitutes an alpha male, to me it’s a mix of the traditional biological/evolutionary understanding of the term and a developed understanding based on the changes in human society, interaction and survival. To me, humans no longer fit into the natural order and thus the exact same understandings/definitions that are applied to other organisms cannot be applied correctly to us.
Capisce?
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Comments
Ellie 
Peter Well, I have been trying hard at being "a nice guy". Never try to take an advantage of females, be courteous, be open minded, etc… but I usually came out as a good person to know… nothing more… I did lack some self-confidence to a certain degree, but I like being myself… quirky, off-the-wall sense of humor, and bit nerdy. 
Sure some girls came to me crying and lended my shoulder for them to cry on, but that’s all I was to them. So most of the time, I did finish last…
For the record, I asked out 8 women in the past before, and they all turned me down. Of course, the one after that said, yes. 
Still… it was pretty close to just myself being single for the long time to come!
stickyfingers It took me over thirty years to realise this, but deep down, alpha males don’t feel relaxed around alpha females (like us). An alpha male can be a nice guy, but only to beta females.
Alpha Men are basically competitive by nature. An Alpha Woman may start out as their date but in the long run, they become the competition, and if they perceive you as outdoing them in any way, then it’s curtains. They are ruthless and will harm to other alpha’s without conscience as they head on their trajectory to glory.
I’m now with a very masculine and self assured Beta Man. He’s no doormat and he has more grace than the flashy alpha wanker types. We chased each other. We have an equitable relationship with neither attempting to outdo the other. We are comfortable with our differences and inspire each other to be more daring. We have great adventures and make up for each others weaknesses.
Bottom line, if you’re yang, look for the yin in your partner. It pisses me off that I didn’t learn it sooner. Although I had some great lays, what a waste of time and space my old boyfriends were.
Ellie 
http://www.heartless-bitches.com/
as an asian woman i’m sure you’ll eat this site up.